The Commissioner declaired that he was not desirous that they should fall upon any scholastic dispute. It was only to represent to their consideration how farre these that have gone before us in the reformation, hath found it contrare to the constitution of this Church, that hath ever beine the ground of all your Petitions.
In reading of the Acts, it was questioned whither the Clerk should begin at the year 1560 or at the year 1580.
The Commissioner said—It seemes that this worke have had its beginning from the 1560 year of God, and hath had a continuall progresse ane way or other ever since; and I believe Mr Archbald [Johnston the Clerk] is not so ill versed, but without much looking on his booke he could deduce all the Acts either the one way or the other.
The Earle of Argyle urged that, becaus the Confession of Faith was at first subscribed 1580, they would begin at that tyme.
My Lord Lowdoun said—It is true that Act in 1580 is the maine Act against Episcopacie, yet becaus there is a word in it, “as it was then used,” &c.: therefore the case of it as it was then used, would be made cleare in the preceiding years 1560, 1575, 1576, 1577, 1578, &c.; for in all these yeares, Episcopacie came still under consideration: first, before they came to the office itselfe, they came to the corruptions of it, ane whereof was—they assumed to themselves titles and dignities: secondlie, they meddled with civile places: thirdlie, they usurped power and præ-eminencie over their brethren: fourthlie, they confounded offices civill and ecclesiasticall: fifthlie, that they had more rents then was competent to churchmen, and was only imployed for their owne pompe and grandour. All thir at that tyme were corruptions; whatever was above a pastor over a particular flock—so that being condemned in the 1580, the compairing of it with the anterior Acts makes it cleare, and so it is follie for men to object that that Act against Episcopacie was but only against that dependencie that it had from the Pope: for its cleare that they call ane Protestant Bishope, above a pastor of a particular flocke was chapped at: and take this from them and let them sie what remaines of that office? Then when it was condemned out of the Church of Scotland as having nothing adoe there—as wanting warrand from the Word of God, in place of it, with consent of auctoritie, Presbyteriall governement was sett downe; and [in one] of the last Acts of ane and the same Assembly 1581—“whither there was a totall abolition of Bishops in the Assembly at Dundee, 1580”—the Assembly answered, that both the name and office was totallie abolished, and then the Presbyteriall governement put in the place of it, and the discipline sworne unto, wherein is clearlie sett downe what offices was esteemed lawfull; whereof Episcopacie is none, but immediatelie before condemned: so that the connexion between 1574, 1581, is so cleare, when the ane is put out as wanting warrand from the Word, and the other put in as having warrand, and that discipline sworne unto—that I thinke there is many here would be glad of ane occasion to cleare the matter by dispute to your Graces satisfaction. And becaus his Majestie was not pleased, at our last happie meeting with him, to approve some of our proceedings, it is very good reason these grounds be cleared againe, that we may be that happie as to have the civile sanction added unto it; and, on the other hand, that it be all our cares, with that loyaltie and duetie that becomes us, and all tender respect to our Kings Majesties honour, but to mantaine the same as farr as the cheefest of these parasites that speakes his Majestie so fair.
Mr Alexʳ Henrysone read a testimony out of ane Epistle of Bezaes, written to Mr Lennox, dated July 12, 1572, testifying that not only was Episcopacie put out of this Kirk, but knowene to all the world to be soe.
The Commissioner said—I intend not to presse any thing but in that way that shall be satisfactorie to all; yet there are some rockes and difficulties wherein possiblie our Masters name is ingaged, and I wishe we may take notice of these, and stryve to come by them.
The Moderatour answered—Your Graces expression is verie good; but becaus they that know not these rockes well, cannot saill by them; if your Grace should be pleased to specifie these rockes, we should endeavour to hold off them.
The Commissioner answered—I desire, so much charitie of them that heares me, as to believe that I may heare, and possibly have heard, some thinges of that consequence that they toutch my instructions verie farre—not for what may concerne the bussines; therefore, I should wishe we should rather seeme to misken some thinges, rather then toutching them, to make unnecessary disputes. I conceave we desire nothing but peace and trueth: therefore let us take a course to establishe these two, and whatever may hinder these, I take to be the rockes. I have so good and charitable opinion of some men, that I would yet wishe thinges were prepaired by them in privat, for [fear of] mistakes; for some thinges may very possiblie escape some men here that I cannot sit heir but make answer in a way that I have not as yet. I desired yesterday to speake with the Moderatour, and I believe he understands me and I him better then we did; and, therefore, I say over againe, for feare of mistakes, I should wishe that everie thing [be] now prepaired and consulted betwixt me and the Moderatour, with some other wise and honourable Members of the Assembly, and not proponed in publict till it were thus prepaired.
The Moderatour answered—If it might please your Grace, so farr as I conceave, there needed no preparation, but only the expression of it by a mouth that well can, such as your Grace is.