Ever yours,
D. Ricardo.
Note.—This wide gap of more than a year between the eighty-first and the eighty-second letter of this collection may be filled up by a letter to Say (Œuvres Diverses, p. 423), dated from London, 5th March, 1822, and being a somewhat tardy answer to Say's letter of July, 1821, quoted above, p. 182. He says in effect: We are nearer agreement than I thought, and your distinction of natural and costly utility illustrated by the iron and the gold is objectionable only in point of expression. But it follows that commodities have a value equal to the quantity of labour spent on them, and that therefore if a pound of gold for example could be produced with less labour it would fall in value. You for your part therefore are bound to maintain it would be a less portion of our [social] wealth. Whereas for my part I do not estimate wealth by value, but by utility from whatever source derived. Your 'Catéchisme' (of which Francis Place has just given me the 2nd edition) says that a man's wealth is in proportion to the value and not to the quantity of the things he possesses, but, as you add that that same value is estimated by the quantity of other things these same things will buy, wealth turns out to be in proportion to quantity of goods after all. If wealth is value, then to lessen all costs, so as to produce all things with less labour, would be to make the wealth of the world no greater. After some remarks on the 'two loaves,' he concludes by saying that the Political Economy Club had made Say an honorary member. 'We hope in time to raise ourselves from a Club to the dignity of an Academy, and become a learned body with ever-increasing numbers.'
Say replies (1st May, 1822) that he gratefully accepts the honorary membership. As to the points discussed, some of their differences are merely verbal. His most important contention is that in production we exchange productive services for products, and the more products we obtain for them the more value they have, and the richer we are. 'Moreover, I do not think that we should aim at giving abstract definitions especially of wealth,—definitions, that is to say, in which we should abstract from the possessor and the thing possessed. This was the method of medieval disputants, and this was the very reason they could never come to an understanding. Too general a definition, which enters into none of the peculiarities of each several object, teaches us nothing.'
He concludes his letter by lamenting that his countrymen paid so little attention to economical questions. A full half of his audience in the Conservatoire des Arts et Métiers consisted of foreigners—English, Russians, Poles, Germans, Spaniards, Portuguese, and Greeks. The Crown Prince of Denmark got private lessons from him.
LXXXII.
Bromesberrow Place, Ledbury, Dec. 16, 1822.
My dear Malthus,
A long time has elapsed since there has been any connection between us, and I take an early opportunity after my arrival in England to address a few lines to you principally with a view of having some account of yourself and family, from your own pen. I have been actively employed since we last met, for not only have I wandered about Switzerland but I have been as far as Florence. In my way to Florence I deviated from the direct road to see Venice, and on my return from it I did the same thing in order to visit Genoa. Our journey has been an uncommonly prosperous one, for we have all enjoyed perfect health and have met with few or no difficulties. My companions as well as myself have very much enjoyed this tour. When I was at Geneva I saw a good deal of our friend Dumont, who accompanied us to Chamouny and returned with us to Geneva. At Coppet[258] I met M. Sismondi. He, the Duke of Broglie, and I had a long conversation on the points of difference between us: the Duke took my side, but after a long battle we each of us I believe remained in the same opinion that we commenced the discussion in. M. Sismondi has left a pleasing impression on my mind. Madame de Broglie had a great deal of patience and forbearance. She is, I think, a very agreeable lady. I stayed in Paris three weeks just previous to my return to England. M. de Broglie and the Baron de Stael arrived there after me. I had the pleasure of seeing them two or three times. I was very much pleased with M. Gallois[259], who made me acquainted with M. Destutt [de] Tracy[260], a very agreeable old gentleman, whose works I had read with pleasure. I do not entirely agree with him in his political economy; he is one of Say's school; there are, nevertheless, some points of difference between them. I saw Say several times, but our conversation did not turn much on subjects connected with political economy; he never led to those subjects, and I always fancied he did not much like to talk upon them. His brother, Louis Say[261], has published a thick volume of remarks upon Adam Smith's, his brother's, your, and my opinions. He is not satisfied with any of us. His principal object is to show that wealth consists in the abundance of enjoyable commodities; he accuses us all of wishing to keep up what we call valuable commodities, without any regard to quantity, about which only the political economist should be anxious. I do not believe that any of us will plead guilty to this charge. I feel fully assured that I do not merit it should be made against me.