"No," objected Parry, "our point is that they are the same thing."
"But I don't believe you really think so, or that anyone can."
"And I don't believe that anyone cannot!"
"Do you mean to say that you really agree with Bentham that, quantity of pleasure being equal, pushpin is as good as poetry?"
"Yes; at least I agree with what he means, though the particular example doesn't appeal to me, for I hardly know what either pushpin or poetry is."
"Well then, let us take Plato's example. Do you think that, quantity of pleasure being equal, scratching oneself when one itches is as good as, say, pursuing scientific research."
"Yes. But of course the point is that quantity of pleasure is not equal."
"You mean," interposed Ellis, "that there is more pleasure in scratching?"
"No, of course not."
"But at least you will admit that there is more pleasure in some physical experiences? Plato, for example, takes the case of a catamite."