Hyl. I frankly own, Philonous, that it is in vain to stand out any longer. Colours, sounds, tastes, in a word all those termed secondary qualities, have certainly no existence without the mind. But by this acknowledgment I must not be supposed to derogate anything from the reality of Matter, or external objects; seeing it is no more than several philosophers maintain[796], who nevertheless are the farthest imaginable from denying Matter. For the clearer understanding of this, you must know sensible qualities are by philosophers divided into Primary and Secondary[797]. The former are Extension, Figure, Solidity, Gravity, Motion, and Rest; and these they hold exist really in Bodies. The latter are those above enumerated; or, [pg 398] briefly, all sensible qualities beside the Primary; which they assert are only so many sensations or ideas existing nowhere but in the mind. But all this, I doubt not, you are apprised of. For my part, I have been a long time sensible there was such an opinion current among philosophers, but was never thoroughly convinced of its truth until now.
Phil. You are still then of opinion that extension and figures are inherent in external unthinking substances?
Hyl. I am.
Phil. But what if the same arguments which are brought against Secondary Qualities will hold good against these also?
Hyl. Why then I shall be obliged to think, they too exist only in the mind.
Phil. Is it your opinion the very figure and extension which you perceive by sense exist in the outward object or material substance?
Hyl. It is.
Phil. Have all other animals as good grounds to think the same of the figure and extension which they see and feel?
Hyl. Without doubt, if they have any thought at all.
Phil. Answer me, Hylas. Think you the senses were bestowed upon all animals for their preservation and well-being in life? or were they given to men alone for this end?