Pursuing the conversation, I asked the Chief Justice where he found authority in the Constitution for the issue of non-legal-tender currency. He answered in the power to borrow money and in the power given to Congress to provide for the "general welfare of the United States." I then said, having in mind the opinion in the case of MacCulloch and Maryland, in which the court held that where a power was given to Congress, its exercise was a matter of discretion unless a limitation could be found in the Constitution: "Where do you find a limitation to the power to borrow money by any means that to Congress may appear wise?" The Chief Justice was unable to specify a limitation, and the question remains unanswered to this day.
When the case of Hepburn and Griswold was overruled in the Legal Tender cases, the Chief Justice was very much disturbed, and with the exhibition of considerable feeling, he said: "Why did you consent to the appointment of judges to overrule me?" I assured him that there was no personal feeling on the part of the President, and that as to my own unimportant part in the business, he had known from the time of our interview in regard to the former action of the court that I entertained the opinion that the decision operated as a limitation of the constitutional powers of Congress and that its full and final recognition might prove injurious to the country whenever all its resources should be required. At the time of the reversal, the Chief Justice did not conceal his dissatisfaction with his life and labors on the bench, and at the interview last mentioned he said that he should be glad to exchange positions with me, if it were possible to make the exchange.
Various reasons have been assigned for the step which was taken by President Grant in asking Judge Hoar to retire from the Cabinet. Some have assumed that the President was no longer willing to tolerate the presence of two members from the same State. That consideration had been passed upon by the President at the outset, and he had overruled it or set it aside. In my interview with Mr. Washburne the Sunday before my nomination, I had said to him that Judge Hoar and I were not only from the same State, but that we were residents of the same county, and within twenty miles of each other. Moreover, any public dissatisfaction which had existed at the beginning had disappeared. In the meantime the President had become attached to Judge Hoar. Nor is there any justifying foundation for the conjecture that a vacancy was created for the purpose of giving a place in the Cabinet to another person, or to another section of the country. General Grant's attachment to his friends was near to a weakness, and the suggestion that he sacrificed Judge Hoar to the low purpose of giving a place to some other person is far away from any true view of his character.
Judge Hoar had had no administrative experience on the political side of the government, and he underestimated the claims, and he undervalued the rights, of members of Congress. As individuals the members of Congress are of the Government, and in a final test the two Houses may become the Government. More than elsewhere the seat of power is in the Senate, and the Senate and Senators are careful to exact a recognition of their rights. They claim, what from the beginning they have enjoyed, the right to be heard by the President and the heads of departments in their respective States. They do not claim to speak authoritatively, but as members of the Government having a right to advise, and under a certain responsibility to the people for what may be done.
It was claimed by Senators that the Attorney-General seemed not to admit their right to speak in regard to appointments, and that appointments were made of which they had no knowledge, and of which neither they nor their constituents could approve. These differences reached a crisis when Senators (I use the word in the plural) notified the President that they should not visit the Department of Justice while Judge Hoar was Attorney-General. Thus was a disagreeable alternative presented to the President, and a first impression would lead to the conclusion that he ought to have sustained the Attorney- General. Assuming that the complaints were well founded, it followed that the Attorney-General was denying to Senators the consideration which the President himself was recognizing daily.
President Grant looked upon members of his Cabinet as his family for the management of civil affairs, as he had looked upon his staff as his military family for the conduct of the army, and he regarded a recommendation for a Cabinet appointment as an interference. His first Cabinet was organized upon that theory somewhat modified by a reference to locality. Mr. Borie who became Secretary of the Navy was a most excellent man, but he had had no preparation either by training or experience for the duties of a department. Of this he was quite conscious, and he never attempted to conceal the fact. He often said:
"The department is managed by Admiral Porter, I am only a figure-head."
In a few months he resigned. His associates were much attached to him. He was a benevolent, genial, well informed man. His successor, Mr. Robeson, was a man of singular ability, lacking only the habit of careful, continuous industry. This failing contributed to his misfortunes in administration and consequently he was the subject of many attacks in the newspapers and in Congress. After his retirement he became a member of the House of Representatives, and it was a noticeable fact, that from that day the attacks in Congress ceased. As a debater he was well equipped, and in reference to his administration of the Navy Department, he was always prepared with an answer or an explanation in every exigency.
The appointment of Governor Fish to the Department of State, gave rise to considerable adverse comment. The chief grounds of complaint were that he was no longer young and that recently he had not been active in political contests. He had been a Whig when there was a Whig Party, and he became a Republican when the Republican Party was formed. As a Whig he had been a member of the House of Representatives and of the Senate of the United States, but he had not held office as a Republican, nor was he known generally as a speaker or writer in support of the policies or principles of the party. His age, then about sixty, was urged as a reason against his appointment. His selection as Secretary was extremely fortunate for General Grant and his administration. Governor Fish was painstaking in his office, exacting in his demands upon subordinates, without being harsh or unjust, diligent in his duties, and fully informed as to the traditions and usages of his department. Beyond these administrative qualities he had the capacity to place every question of a diplomatic character upon a foundation at once reasonable and legal. If the failure of Mr. Stewart led to the appointment of Governor Fish the change was fortunate for General Grant and the country. After the failure of Mr. Stewart, Mr. Washburne spoke of his appointment to the State Department, as only temporary, but for a few days he acted as though he expected to remain permanently. If his transfer to France was an afterthought, he and the President very carefully concealed that fact. It is not probable that the President at the outset designed to take the Secretary of State and the Secretary of the Treasury from New York City. Hence I infer that the failure of Mr. Stewart worked a change in the headship of the State Department, and hence I am of the opinion that the failure of Mr. Stewart was of great advantage to the administration and to the country, and that without considering whether there was a gain or loss in the Treasury Department. There can be no doubt that Governor Fish was a much wiser man than Mr. Washburne for the management of foreign affairs and there can be as little doubt that Mr. Washburne could not have been excelled as Minister to Paris in the troublous period of the years 1870 and 1871.
Mr. Fish had no ambitions beyond the proper and successful
administration of his own department. He did not aspire to the
Presidency, and he remained in the State Department during General
Grant's second term, at the special request of the President.