Mr. M. L. Shipman, of North Carolina, made a plea for more specific announcements concerning arrangements and place for meetings, in order that there might be less confusion on that account in the future.
The Conference, after a temporary adjournment for the purpose of having a photograph taken, took up, section by section, the discussion of Mr. Mercer's tentative bill.
Upon the question of the proper classification of hazardous employments it was practically agreed that any attempt to include agricultural laborers and domestic servants in a compensation measure, would probably result in failure. "You cannot pass a bill of that sort," declared Dr. McCarthy. "Anybody who has been around a legislature knows that the farmers, on questions of this sort, are way behind the laboring man or the manufacturer; they are full of prejudice and will fight a bill of that kind every time."
The constitutional difficulties in New York were discussed by Senator Bayne who laid special stress upon: (1) the death limit clause; (2) the right of trial by jury; and the due process clause. "Some of us," said Senator Bayne, "have about concluded that the only way we can justify any compensation act for industrial accidents will be through the exercise of the police power of the State. And we think this principle lies at the bottom of the police power: that it is competent for the legislature to declare that a proposed remedy is based upon the police power, but it must in fact be dangerous to the health or public safety or welfare of the community. The mere fact that the legislature so declares it, does not make it so. It is subject to investigation by the courts, and if they find that it is reasonable then they will leave it to the legislature to declare the extent of authority under that police power with those limitations."
In answer to these objections Mr. Mercer cited numerous court decisions (printed in pamphlet form by Mr. Mercer) which led him to feel more sanguine of what may be accomplished under our constitutions. In answer to Prof. Seager's question: "Is it probable that the court will take the view that a general workmen's compensation act is a reasonable exercise of the police power?" Mr. Mercer replied:
"My understanding of that is that under the general theory where twenty-three of the most important foreign countries have passed legislation on the theory that there was a reasonable foundation for it, where six or seven of the forty-six states have passed laws requiring commissions to investigate this proposition, where men would meet at Atlantic City and discuss this subject as we did for two days, where the National Civic Federation devoted a day to it in New York, and where we devote a day to it here, where there is literature all over the country and every magazine has some article on the subject at the present time, and probably all of the corporations coming around to the view that we need certain legislation, I do not believe any court would say that there is any opposition to a reasonable discussion of the question, and that the legislature has not the right to declare it was a dangerous employment if we limit it to the industries that have hazards."
Prof. Seager outlined the plan of "extra-hazardous" occupation classifications favored by the New York Commission and Dr. McCarthy pointed out the danger of too much definition. "My experience with bill-drafting is that in getting the most simple statement of a case, the less you say, the better."
Mr. John Lundrigan, of New York, gave it as his opinion that "any scheme of compensation that follows the job or the employment, instead of the individual, is wrong and will fail." He said he did not believe men engaged in hazardous occupations would be willing to waive their right to undertake to recover in the courts whenever it could be shown that the employer was negligent.
[The stenographer who reported the remainder of this brief session lost his notes, and there is no further record].