2177. I understood you to say, that no honest man would undertake, and therefore I presume you would not have recommended anybody to undertake, so strict a condition as that of which we are speaking?—I am afraid you are putting a wrong construction upon what I said; I say, no honest man would undertake a condition which he could not honestly say he could perform. If I bound myself to go in a certain number of hours between certain points, an honest man would say, if that was a great speed, “I cannot bind myself to accomplish that.”
2178. That would prevent an honest man from complying with the conditions imposed upon the Peninsular and Oriental Steam Packet Company?—That is putting it in the other way; I am certain that I would have taken the contract, because I know that Government would not exact the penalty.
2179. You would have taken it, though an honest man would not have taken it?—I am afraid you are misinterpreting me; you use the words “honest man” in a different sense from that in which I use them. I mean to say that an honest man could not honestly undertake to do a thing which was almost impracticable; but, as I know the Government would not have exacted the penalty, I would have taken the contract if I had had an opportunity; but I had no opportunity.
2180. You would have taken the contract?—Yes, anybody would take the contract for £170,000 a year; nobody would have refused it.
2181. You were under the impression that the Peninsular and Oriental Company were so strong that nobody could compete with them?—Yes, and that is the impression now.
2182. That was your impression at the time you lent your aid to the drawing up of that petition?—Yes, it was.
2183. It was the impression, you believe, of the parties who signed the petition?—Yes.
2184. Is that, in point of fact, one of the allegations of the petition?—I do not know.
2185. Are not the allegations of the petition totally of a different effect; are they not against contracts in general?—Certainly not against contracts in general; they are against contracts being given without fair competition; they are not against contracts generally, for contracts must be had somehow, but they should be fair and open.
2186. The prayer of the petition is “that public money granted for the purposes of steam navigation shall be applied, not for the exclusive advantage of any companies or individuals, but so that all engaged in shipping may fairly participate therein, or equally compete; therefore affording to your petitioners the opportunity of showing to your Honourable House the truth (if doubted) as to facts and principles of all the statements of this their humble petition.” If you were under the impression that the Admiralty were actuated by so corrupt a spirit that it was not of any use for solvent parties to send in tenders, will you explain to the Committee why it was that you left that out, as one of the allegations of the petition which you drew up at the time?—I do not understand the question.