Lord Melbourne presents his humble duty to your Majesty. Lord Melbourne had certainly never expected that this demand would be urged, and therefore had never advised your Majesty as to what was to be done in such a case. Lord Melbourne strongly advises your Majesty to hear what the Duke of Wellington and Sir Robert Peel urge, but to take time before you come to a peremptory and final decision.
Viscount Melbourne to Queen Victoria.
9th May 1839.
Lord Melbourne presents his humble duty to your Majesty. This is a matter of so much importance, and may have such grave results, that any advice which Lord Melbourne could give would be of little importance unless it coincided with the opinions of others, and particularly of all those who were and intend still [to] continue to be his colleagues.
It will depend upon their determination whether your Majesty is to be supported or not. The best course will perhaps be that you should hear Sir Robert Peel's determination, say nothing, but send for Lord Melbourne, and lay the matter before him. Lord Melbourne will then summon a Cabinet to consider of it.
Extract from the Queen's Journal.
THE LADIES OF THE BEDCHAMBER
9th May 1839.
At half-past six came Lord Melbourne and stayed with me till ten minutes past seven.
I then began by giving him a detailed account of the whole proceeding, which I shall state here as briefly as possible. I first again related what took place in the two first interviews, and when I said that the Duke said he had assisted my Government often very much, Lord Melbourne said: "Well, that is true enough, but the Duke did all he could about this vote." "Well, then," I said, "when Sir Robert Peel came this morning, he began first about the Ministry. I consented, though I said I might have my personal feelings about Lord Lyndhurst and Lord Aberdeen, but that I would suppress every personal feeling and be quite fair. I then repeated that I wished to retain about me those who were not in Parliament, and Sir Robert pretended that I had the preceding day expressed a wish to keep about me those who were in Parliament. I mentioned my wish to have Lord Liverpool, to which Sir Robert readily acceded, saying he would offer him the place of Lord Steward, or of Lord in Waiting. He then suggested my having Lord Ashley,36 which I said I should like, as Treasurer or Comptroller.THE LADIES Soon after this Sir Robert said: 'Now, about the Ladies,' upon which I said I could not give up any of my Ladies, and never had imagined such a thing. He asked if I meant to retain all. 'All,' I said. 'The Mistress of the Robes and the Ladies of the Bedchamber?' I replied, 'All,'—for he said they were the wives of the opponents of the Government, mentioning Lady Normanby37 in particular as one of the late Ministers' wives. I said that would not interfere; that I never talked politics with them, and that they were related, many of them, to Tories, and I enumerated those of my Bedchamber women and Maids of Honour; upon which he said he did not mean all the Bedchamber women and all the Maids of Honour, he meant the Mistress of the Robes and the Ladies of the Bedchamber; to which I replied they were of more consequence than the others, and that I could not consent, and that it had never been done before. He said I was a Queen Regnant, and that made the difference. 'Not here,' I said—and I maintained my right. Sir Robert then urged it upon public grounds only, but I said here I could not consent. He then begged to be allowed to consult with the Duke upon such an important matter. I expressed a wish also to see the Duke, if Sir Robert approved, which he said he did, and that he would return with the Duke, if I would then be prepared for the decision, which I said I would. Well," I continued, "the Duke and Sir Robert returned soon, and I first saw the Duke, who talked first of his being ready to take the post of Secretary for Foreign Affairs, which I had pressed Peel to urge on him (the Duke having first wished to be in the Cabinet, without accepting office), and the Duke said, 'I am able to do anything,' for I asked him if it would not be too much for him. Then I told him that I had been very well satisfied with Sir Robert yesterday, and asked the Duke if Sir Robert had told him what had passed about the Ladies. He said he had, and then I repeated all my arguments, and the Duke his; but the Duke and Sir Robert differed considerably on two points. The Duke said the opinions of the Ladies were nothing, but it was the principle, whether the Minister could remove the Ladies or not, and that he (the Duke) had understood it was stated in the Civil List Bill, 'that the Ladies were instead of the Lords,' which is quite false, and I told the Duke that there were not twelve Lords, as the expense with the Ladies would have been too great." Lord Melbourne said: "There you had the better of him, and what did he say?" "Not much," I replied. I repeated many of my arguments, all which pleased Lord Melbourne, and which he agreed to, amongst others, that I said to the Duke, Was Sir Robert so weak that even the Ladies must be of his opinion? The Duke denied that. The Duke then took my decision to Sir Robert, who was waiting in the next room; after a few minutes Sir Robert returned. After stopping a few minutes, as I have already stated, Sir Robert went to see his colleagues, and returned at five: said he had consulted with those who were to have been his colleagues, and that they agreed that, with the probability of being beat the first night about the Speaker, and beginning with a Minority in the House of Commons, that unless there was some (all the Officers of State and Lords I gave up) demonstration of my confidence, and if I retained all my Ladies this would not be, "they agreed unanimously they could not go on." I replied I would reflect, that I felt certain I should not change my mind, but that I should do nothing in a hurry, and would write him my decision either that evening or the next morning. He said, meanwhile, he would suspend all further proceedings.