Mr. O’Connell. No. I think that language that you use comes from an old report of the Dies committee. I was never regional director for the IWO. The only connection that I had with the IWO is that in the city of Butte the IWO had an affiliated local or lodge there composed of Serbs and Croats and there was considerable division particularly during the war period, World War II period, because if I remember correctly there was a religious difference. I think the Serbs in the organization were Protestants and the Croats were Catholics. There was a division then over the politics of the situation. I think there were some of them who were supporting Milhailovich at that time and some who were supporting Pavlich, if I remember the names correctly.
I was asked by—I am pretty sure the man’s name was Peter Shipka, who was the officer of the International Workers Order, who asked me if I would advise with the lodge and if I would help them try to straighten out the difficulties so that the lodge could go ahead.
After that I was sent down to the State of Colorado or asked by them to go down to the State of Colorado where I think about 11 members of the IWO had applied for their citizenship papers in a little town I think called Steamboat Springs, Colo., and the Federal judge who was hearing the citizenship matter at that time was in my opinion confusing the IWO with the IWW, and I was asked and again I wouldn’t be sure who the national officer of the IWO was, but my best recollection at the time—and I think that was in 1940 or 1941 or 1942, it was a long time ago—asked me to go down there and I talked with the judge and with the examiner and also brought a Mr. Cunningham who I think was either the State auditor or the secretary of state, but was ex officio commissioner of insurance of the State of Colorado, to show the judge the IWO was actually a fraternal benefit society and had no connection with the IWW.
Then later, I can’t remember what year, the IWO was promoting what they called a Plan for Plenty, which was in essence an improvement on the present social security, or I mean on the social security system as it existed at that time.
I made speeches at various IWO lodges in different parts of the country speaking on the Plan for Plenty, explaining the legislative detail in connection with it.
Mr. Tavenner. Who made arrangements with you to conduct this nationwide speaking tour that you mentioned?
Mr. O’Connell. Well, it is so long ago, it is hard for me—there are just two names that stick out in my memory as far as the IWO is concerned and the only two I can remember are Peter Shipka, the treasurer, and if I remember correctly they had an attorney named Joseph Brodsky. Those are the two names that stick out in my mind.
Mr. Tavenner. Was Joseph Brodsky from New York?
Mr. O’Connell. Yes; he was from New York.
Mr. Tavenner. What compensation did you receive while engaged in that work for the IWO?