Mr. Stone was in favor of the motion. He observed, that it was a painful consideration that a number of citizens should be disfranchised, and deprived of their reason and speech, but this is a dilemma to which we shall be reduced by means of this excise law; we must either deprive the excise officers of this privilege of interfering, or give up the freedom of elections.
Mr. Vining controverted the oft-repeated observation, that there was an analogy between the two countries, Great Britain and America. He urged an acceleration of the bill; delays he thought did not produce conviction, they only serve to inflame; he hoped the clause would not be agreed to, nor the bill recommitted.
Mr. Lawrence was sorry that there were so many impediments thrown in the way of this bill. He could wish that the clause might be deferred, and made the subject of a separate discussion. He objected to it as not extensive enough. It ought to include all the officers of the Government. At present, he should waive any further remarks, but hoped the motion would not be agreed to at this time, but wished that the bill might be finished.
Mr. Sedgwick opposed the motion. He said, the natural tendency would be to render the law odious; to deprive the Government of the services of the best men in our country. Let me ask gentlemen, if they, or any of their connections, would accept an appointment under this law, with such an exceptionable clause in it? He observed on the total difference in the circumstances of this country and those of Great Britain; and asked, shall we transplant the corrupt maxims of that country to this? I hope we shall not.
Mr. Gerry replied to the several objections which had been offered against the motion. It will be too late, said he, when the evil takes place to apply the remedy. The President will then have it in his power to influence the elections in such manner as to procure a Legislature that would not consent to a law for applying a remedy.
Mr. Ames reprobated the motion in very pointed terms, as impolitic in respect to the law, as repugnant to the constitution, and as degrading to human nature. Besides, he observed, that it was nugatory in itself, because it goes to deprive the citizens of an inalienable right, which you cannot take from them, nor can they divest themselves of it.
Mr. Jackson made a short reply to Mr. Ames. He observed, that he had always supposed that the English nation possessed a constitution, and that the violation of the freedom of elections was the greatest infringement on that constitution.
Mr. Sherman observed, that this motion went to create a positive offence. He said he could not conceive any reason why this offence should be chargeable on one description of officers only; he thought it ought to go through, and include every class. He replied to the several objections arising from the influence of the President; and observed, that fixing such a stigma would oblige the President to appoint mean and ordinary characters—characters fit to make tools of; for persons of credit and respectability will not accept of appointments under such a disqualification.
The question was determined in the negative, the yeas and nays being as follows:
Yeas.—Messrs. Ashe, Baldwin, Bloodworth, Brown, Burke, Floyd, Gerry, Grout, Hathorn, Heister, Jackson, Livermore, Mathews, Moore, Parker, Rensselaer, Seney, Sylvester, Stone, Tucker, and White—21.