Mr. Livingston was sorry the answer was not drafted so as to avoid this debate. He said it was his sincere desire and hope that the candor of gentlemen who advocated the Address in its present form, and those who wished it amended, would so combine as to make it agreeable to all. He said he intended to oppose the amendments which had been proposed, although he did not see the Address every way right; with a view to reconcile parties, when the present motion was disposed of, he should move to strike out some words, in order to insert others. He could not, like some gentlemen, draw consolation from the misfortunes of other nations; their distresses were rather matter of regret; nor did he see a propriety, as another gentleman had done, of likening our affairs with those of the members of a family; but, even if it would bear, he could not see that tranquillity in this family as was expressed. His only objection, he said, to the paragraph in question, was the words "tranquil prosperity." He believed the United States did not enjoy that tranquil prosperity; on the contrary, he thought this was a time of great calamity in the country, and he thought that it was owing, principally, to the measures of the Government. There were other clauses in the Address, he said, he should, when they came to be considered, make objections to, and he thought they could be all easily removed by motions suitable; however, he said there were many sentiments in the Address in which he heartily concurred. He should vote against the striking out the eight clauses in question, as he thought such amendments could be proposed as would make the Address meet his hearty concurrence, and he believed give general satisfaction.
Mr. Giles' motion was then put, to strike out those clauses, and negatived.
Mr. Parker renewed the motion he made yesterday, to strike out the words "freest and most enlightened in the world."
Mr. Ames hoped that the motion to strike out would not prevail; for, without being over tenacious on the subject, he must give a preference to the copy of the report which was printed; the members had the advantage of weighing it in their minds, which they would lose by adopting the substitute; besides, he thought the ideas were so crowded in that proposed, as to render it heavy; he hoped the reported Address would be agreed to.
Mr. Harper's motion was then put and negatived. Twenty-five members only voting for the motion.
Mr. Parker again moved to strike out "freest and most enlightened," &c.
Mr. W. Smith said yesterday, in the discussion on the subject, gentlemen had assigned for their reason to strike out those words that other nations would be offended at us. It was usual, he said, for nations to applaud themselves, and he thought it could give no offence to any. He did not hear gentlemen mention what nation was meant. He presumed the only nation that could be alluded to was the French Republic. If, however, it can be proved that they have used similar language, he supposed it would give gentlemen some ease as to this particular. In looking over some papers, he had seen several bombastical expressions in a note of Barthelemy, a report to the Convention of Laviere, and of Cambaceres, in the name of the three committees. In one are these words, "a Government so powerful as the French." In another, he calls it "the most enlightened in the civilized world." In another, "the first in the universe." He hoped that while that nation could use expressions like these, the gentlemen of this House would not think the expressions referred to would give offence to that or any other nation.
Mr. Parker said, when he made the motion he did not refer to any particular nation; he had neither France nor England in view; he did not wish to see us contrast our political situation with that of any other country. His objections to the words, he said, arose from our making the declaration ourselves. Our Government, he acknowledged, was free; it was the best, in his opinion, any where. He wished to believe the people as enlightened as any other; he believed they were, and if they were not, they had only themselves to blame; but however enlightened or free we were, in his opinion, we were not the proper organs to declare it; however enlightened we might be, he thought the last four years Administration had convinced many, as well as himself, that the Administration was not the most enlightened; if they had, they would not have suffered such shameful spoliations on our commerce, and shameful acts of cruelty to our seamen. He said the two little monarchies of Denmark and Sweden, neither of which, in point of extent, can be compared with the United States, more (to use the comparison of the gentleman from Pennsylvania yesterday) than a speck is to the sun; nor are they either of them in population nearly equal to the United States; and although they are surrounded by the greatest warlike powers in a belligerent state, yet they have preserved their neutrality inviolate; their ships have not been wantonly seized, nor have their seamen been torn from their ships, or whipped at the gang-way of British ships-of-war, or been shot by their press-gangs. To mention the instances of British cruelty towards our seamen in every instance that could be adduced, would take up time unnecessarily; one alone, that recently happened, I shall relate:
The brother of a member of this House (Mr. Franklin, of N. C.) was impressed on board a British ship-of-war in the West Indies; he was unacquainted with seamanship, having only made a passage from North Carolina to the Islands; being awkward and not being a seaman, he was discharged. The same evening, a press-gang of the same ship fell in with him and made him a prisoner; in attempting to make his escape, he was shot at. The ball was aimed at his body; it was not winged with death, but the young man was wounded in the hand.
Mr. Ames said, if any man were to call himself more free and enlightened than his fellows, it would be considered as arrogant self-praise. His very declaration would prove that he wanted sense as well as modesty, but a nation might be called so, by a citizen of that nation, without impropriety; because, in doing so, he bestows no praise of superiority on himself; he may be in fact, and may be sensible that he is less enlightened than the wise of other nations. This sort of national eulogium may, no doubt, be fostered by vanity, and grounded in mistake; it is sometimes just, it is certainly common, and not always either ridiculous or offensive. It did not say that France or England had not been remarkable for enlightened men; their literati are more numerous and distinguished than our own. The character, with respect to this country, he said, was strictly true. Our countrymen, almost universally, possess some property and some pretensions of learning—two distinctions so remarkably in their favor, as to vindicate the expression objected to. But go through France, Germany, and most countries of Europe, and it will be found that, out of fifty millions of people, not more than two or three had any pretensions to knowledge, the rest being, comparatively with Americans, ignorant. In France, which contains twenty-five millions of people, only one was calculated to be in any respect enlightened, and, perhaps, under the old system, there was not a greater proportion possessed property; whilst in America, out of four millions of people, scarcely any part of them could be classed upon the same ground with the rabble of Europe. That class called vulgar, canaille, rabble, so numerous there, does not exist here as a class, though our towns have many individuals of it. Look at the lazzaroni of Naples; there are twenty thousand or more houseless people, wretched, and in want! He asked whether, where men wanted every thing, and were in proportion of 29 to 1, it was possible they could be trusted with power? Wanting wisdom and morals, how would they use it? It was, therefore, that the iron-hand of despotism was called in by the few who had any thing, to preserve any kind of control over the many. This evil, as it truly was, and which he did not propose to commend, rendered true liberty hopeless. In America, out of four millions of people, the proportion which cannot read and write, and who, having nothing, are interested in plunder and confusion, and disposed for both, is small. In the Southern States, he knew there were people well-informed; he disclaimed all design of invidious comparison; the members from the South would be more capable of doing justice to their constituents, but in the Eastern States he was more particularly conversant, and knew the people in them could generally read and write, and were well-informed as to public affairs. In such a country, liberty is likely to be permanent. They are enlightened enough to be free. It is possible to plant it in such a soil, and reasonable to hope that it will take root and flourish long, as we see it does. But can liberty, such as we understand and enjoy, exist in societies where the few only have property, and the many are both ignorant and licentious?