Mr. Conrad was in favor of the indefinite postponement of the resolution. He did not think the subject ought to be acted upon at this session. He was not unfriendly to the principle, but he never could consent that a bare majority of Congress should have the power to remove a judge. If the amendment was so framed as to give the President a discretionary power to remove a judge on the address of a majority of the two Houses, and to make the removal imperative on the vote of two-thirds, he might be for it. At any rate he thought it best to postpone the subject until the next session.
Mr. J. Randolph.—I am as anxious as any man for a decision of the question implicated in several of the resolutions laid on our table, and for a good reason. My tobacco is unsold. I feel the full force of the observations of my colleague. I know that these resolutions have already given rise to much nefarious speculation. When I called for information, I had no idea of the time it would take to get it; and had I been apprised of it, I do not know whether I should not have preferred acting in the dark to waiting for it.
There is another reason why I wish this subject (amendment to the constitution) taken up at this session. When I offered this resolution at the last session, it was said to be too near the close of the session to act upon it—this was acknowledged. But, it was said, print it and let it go abroad. This has been done. But the reason for which I wish it acted upon this session is, that the elections intervene between this and the next session. Gentlemen may say what they please of the principle of quamdiu bene se gesserit, but I believe if the members of this House held their seats for seven years, their conduct would not be the same as it is under the present tenure. I wish to recur to that good old principle that sends the Representative back to render an account of his actions to his constituents. After the next election gentlemen will obtain credit for two years more of good behavior. I believe my friend from Virginia will allow this to be a good reason against a postponement.
As gentlemen have stated the substance of the resolution as a reason for its postponement, I will state its substance as a reason for not postponing it. One gentleman says he will not consent that the judges shall hold their offices subject to the will of a bare majority of the two Houses. But does not every thing of importance depend on that majority? Do they not appropriate millions? Do they not hold the purse and the sword? Or do gentlemen think the woolsack more important? This is most indubitably the case; and I wish to hear any reasoning against giving efficiency to the will of a majority that does not approximate the doctrine of the Polish veto. There can be no reason for this distinction. And, so far from there being danger of this power being abused, the experience of all Governments holds me out in saying that there is greater danger that the power will not be exercised than that it will be abused. For this plain reason: it would require some overt act of notorious misconduct, or an equally notorious imbecility of mind or body, to justify any man in giving such a vote. It is a point of extreme delicacy to give it; and though some men might, I trust a majority of both branches never would give such a vote for light and frivolous reasons. But it may be thought that, as in all free Governments there are parties, a triumphant party would turn out the judges to get into their places. This would be a most humiliating effect. But on what is the probability of such an effect founded? How are the turners out to be turned in? Have they the power to appoint themselves to office? No. And from our experience heretofore, no such inference can be drawn. There is no probability of one triumphant faction putting down another to get their offices. Because a triumphant faction could not rise to power but at the will of a majority; and although they might take offices away from others, they could not bestow them upon themselves. But suppose they did? It would be for the first and last time. It would be a struggle between office-hunters and the people; and I believe all the experience we have heretofore had shows that this description of men are too prone to union for the public to sustain either profit or loss from their divisions. But if in this opinion I am in error, I would recur back to my first principle to support me. Is the power to remove a judge more important than the power of declaring war, of laying taxes, and of effecting various other national objects? This is a doctrine to me totally unintelligible.
Mr. Smilie observed that he regretted that the motion for an indefinite postponement had been made, as it was equivalent to a rejection of the resolution.
The question was then taken, by yeas and nays, on an indefinite postponement, and passed in the negative—yeas 42, nays 81, as follows:
Yeas.—Willis Alston, jun., Barnabas Bidwell, Phanuel Bishop, James M. Broom, Martin Chittenden, Frederick Conrad, Orchard Cook, Richard Cutts, Samuel W. Dana, Ezra Darby, John Davenport, jun., Peter Early, Caleb Ellis, Ebenezer Elmer, William Ely, James Fisk, Seth Hastings, William Helms, David Hough, Joseph Levis, jun., Henry W. Livingston, Josiah Masters, Jonathan O. Mosely, Gurdon S. Mumford, Jeremiah Nelson, Timothy Pitkin, jun., John Pugh, Josiah Quincy, Martin G. Schuneman, John Cotton Smith, William Stedman, Lewis B. Sturges, Samuel Taggart, Benjamin Tallmadge, Samuel Tenney, Thomas W. Thompson, Killian K. Van Rensselaer, Joseph B. Varnum, Daniel C. Verplanck, Peleg Wadsworth, Eliphalet Wickes, and Nathan Williams.
Nays.—Evan Alexander, Isaac Anderson, David Bard, Joseph Barker, Burwell Bassett, George M. Bedinger, William Blackledge, John Blake, jun., Thomas Blount, Robert Brown, John Boyle, William Butler, George W. Campbell, John Campbell, Levi Casey, John Chandler, John Claiborne, Christopher Clark, Joseph Clay, Matthew Clay, George Clinton, jun., Jacob Crowninshield, John Dawson, William Dickson, Elias Earle, James Elliot, John W. Eppes, William Findlay, John Fowler, James M. Garnett, Peterson Goodwyn, Andrew Gregg, Isaiah L. Green, Silas Halsey, John Hamilton, David Holmes, John G. Jackson, Walter Jones, Thomas Kenan, Michael Leib, Matthew Lyon, Duncan McFarland, Patrick Magruder, Robert Marion, William McCreery, David Meriwether, Nicholas R. Moore, Thomas Moore, Jeremiah Morrow, John Morrow, Thomas Newton, jun., Joseph H. Nicholson, Gideon Olin, John Randolph, Thomas M. Randolph, John Rea of Pennsylvania, John Rhea of Tennessee, Jacob Richards, John Russell, Peter Sailly, Thomas Sammons, Thomas Sanford, Ebenezer Seaver, James Sloan, John Smilie, John Smith, Samuel Smith, Henry Southard, Thomas Spalding, Richard Stanford, Joseph Stanton, David Thomas, Uri Tracy, Matthew Walton, John Whitehill, Robert Whitehill, David R. Williams, Marmaduke Williams, Alexander Wilson, Richard Wynn, and Thomas Wynns.
Mr. Clark then varied his motion so as to postpone the resolution to the second Monday in March—varied to next Monday, and carried.