"But what will become of people who reject what you call the one only plan of salvation? Will they be doomed to eternal woe? Do you believe in everlasting punishment?"
"Everlasting punishment is God's punishment. That is to say, as God is eternal and His law is eternal, there is punishment eternally ready for the transgressor. But the justice and mercy of God are also eternal. Therefore as every man is to be judged according to his works (Rev. xx: 12), those who are worthy of many stripes will receive their measure of that eternal punishment, and those who are worthy only of a few stripes will receive but their portion. Some will be forgiven in this world through repentance and obedience, others in the next world, and some will have to pay the uttermost farthing. (Luke xii: 47-48; Matt, v: 26; I. Tim. v: 24; Matt, xii: 32; I. John v: 16.) They who sin against the Holy Ghost by denying it after having received it, who wilfully sin against light and truth and become fully possessed of the evil one so that they cannot repent, are 'sons of perdition' for whom there is no redemption. They are doomed with the devil and his angels forever. All the rest will be brought forth in the due time of the Lord in the ages to come and placed in some degree of happiness and glory."
"Do you believe then that there will be different degrees of glory in heaven?"
"I certainly do. Will not justice so determine? Is not every man to be judged according to his works? Would it be right for the good, the true, the just and the pure to reap no fruit from their tree of righteousness? Is not every soul better for the doing of that which is right, and the worse for the doing of that which is wrong, and will God be less fair and equitable than man? Have you not read what Paul says: 'There is one glory of the sun, and another glory of the moon, and another glory of the stars. For one star differeth from another star in glory; so also is the resurrection of the dead?' (I. Cor. xv: 41-42.) The glory of the sun, which is the celestial glory, is for those who receive the gospel, are baptized into Christ, remain faithful to the end, overcome all things, and therefore inherit all things, come forth in the first resurrection and are made kings and priests unto God and His Christ forever (Rev. xx: 4-6). They become like the Father and the Son, dwell in their presence and partake of their glory."
"What do you mean by that? How can man be like God? Is He not a spirit without form, immaterial and incomprehensible?"
"That is a dogma of spurious Christianity, mingled with vain philosophy. Jesus Christ was the express image of the Father. Man also is made in the image of the Father and the Son. Jesus Christ, after His resurrection, when he ascended to the Father, was in the same form and shape and appearance as when in mortality. Those who are in Christ are to be like him in every respect. (Heb. i: 3; I. John iii: 1-2; Phil, iii: 21.) God is a spirit; so also is man. (Job xxxii: 8.) But the Father is a person, just as the Son is, one being like the other in all respects. Jesus is a spirit, dwelling in a spiritual body; the Father is the same, but the Holy Spirit which proceeds from the Father and the Son permeates space and by it God is omnipresent. Our Father, the Father of Our Lord Jesus Christ, who is our Elder Brother, made us all after His own image and likeness (Gen. i: 27). It is strange that professing Christians who regard Jesus Christ as God and admit His personality, form and tangible shape, are horror-stricken when the Latter Day Saints declare that God the Father is a similar being, that statement being borne out by the Scriptures of the Old and New Testaments. The Father, the Son and the Holy Ghost, though one in purpose, design and act, are separate and distinct personalities. The Son came from the Father, prayed to the Father, obeyed the Father, went back to the Father and sat at His right hand, and sent the Holy Spirit after He left the earth to be a Comforter to His disciples. Jesus prayed that all who believed on Him should become one, as He and the Father are one (John xvii: 20-21). This shows that the unity of the Godhead is not identity of person, as many believe, and it is clear to those who understand, that Our Heavenly Father is an individual, just as Christ is, and we shall all be when brought into their presence. We worship the Father, in the name of the Son, under the influence of the Holy Ghost, and expect to fully comprehend them all in the future and perfect state. This is life eternal, that they might know Thee, the only true God, and Jesus Christ whom thou hast sent' (John xvii: 3)."
"You have spoken of the atonement of Christ for the sins of mankind, and yet you insist upon baptism for the remission of sins. How do you reconcile these two doctrines?"
"There is nothing in them at variance with each other. The atonement of Christ was for two purposes. First, for original sin, that is, the sin committed by our first parents in the garden of Eden; and second, for actual sins, that is, those committed by mankind individually. Atonement for the first is unconditional, for the second it is conditional. The posterity of Adam had nothing to do with the atonement for that sin. Its consequence was death, not only to Adam, but to all his descendants. The atonement will bring life to every creature of Adam's race. 'For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall all be made alive.' (I. Cor. xv: 22.) 'The first man Adam was made a living soul, the last Adam was made a quickening spirit (verse 45). Jesus said, 'Marvel not at this, for the hour is coming in the which all that are in the graves shall hear His voice and shall come forth. They that have done good unto the resurrection of life, and they that have done evil unto the resurrection of damnation' (John v: 28-29). This shows that although every one who died through Adam's fall will be raised from the dead through Christ's atonement, 'some will be raised to everlasting life and some to shame and everlasting contempt' (Daniel xii: 2). This is because the atonement for actual sins committed by mankind was made conditionally, that is, conditioned on their reception of Jesus Christ as their Savior, manifested by obedience to His Gospel. The righteous and the wicked will all be raised from the dead, but they will then all be judged according to their works. 'He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; he that believeth not shall be damned' (Mark xvi: 16). Remission of sin comes through the atonement. 'Without the shedding of blood there is no remission of sin' Heb. ix: 22). But this remission is given in baptism preceded by repentance and faith. The first condition is faith in Christ, the second is repentance, the third is baptism. That baptism is for the remission of sins. (See Mark i: 4; Acts ii: 37-38; I. Pet. iii: 21.) That is why baptism is essential and why Jesus told Nicodemus: 'Except a man be born of water and of the spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God' (John iii: 5). The baptized, repentant believer receives remission of sins, is a new creature and ready for the reception of the Holy Ghost or birth of the spirit. This, as I have explained to you, is conferred by the laying on of hands by men having divine authority. Thus you see remission of sins is through the atonement, but is given in baptism. And thus there is no discrepancy between the two doctrines."
"But how do you understand this scripture, and others to the same purport, 'God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in Him should not perish, but have everlasting life?' (John iii: 16.) Does not that show that belief in Christ is alone sufficient for salvation?"
"No, it does not, for verse 5 of the same chapter from which you quote makes birth of water and of the spirit essential. The key to this whole question is in the meaning of belief in Christ. Jesus said: 'He that believeth on Me, the works that I do shall he do also' (John xiv: 12). He also said: 'Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.' Also he said: 'Every one that heareth these sayings of mine, and doeth them not, shall be likened unto a foolish man which built his house upon the sand' (Matthew vii: 21-27). 'Faith without works is dead, and it is only by works that faith is made manifest' (James ii: 17-26). Belief in Christ comprehends belief in His doctrine, manifested by obedience to His gospel. Any other kind of faith is spurious, dead and of no effect. Peter proclaimed Christ's gospel, being full of the Holy Ghost, and he taught the people first to believe in Christ, and when they showed faith and asked what they should do, he answered: 'Repent and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost' (Acts ii: 37-38). If Peter had been a modern minister, he would have said in answer to the question, 'Men and brethren, what shall we do?'—as may be heard from almost every pulpit nowadays, 'Poor sinners, you can do nothing; Christ has done it all. Only believe and you shall be saved and heaven is yours forever.' But Peter taught Christ's gospel, which is a gospel of good works, proceeding from living faith. When Christ sent him and the other apostles to proclaim that gospel he said: 'Go ye, therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son and of the Holy Ghost, teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you' (Matt, xxviii: 19-20).