Therefore says I, Pray will you give him a meeting? God-so says the duke, with all my heart, and I desire nothing more. Now I told him, I had been with my lord Shaftesbury, with other inlargements that I need not trouble your lordship with; well, says he, pray go to him, and try if it be possible to get a meeting; so I went to him and told him; Says I, This is a great unhappiness and it seems to be a great absurdity, that you are so forward to act alone in such a thing as this. Pray, says I, without any more to do, since you have this confidence to send for me, let me prevail with you to meet them, and give them an interview, or else you and I must break. I will no longer hold any correspondence, unless it be so. Says he, I tell you they will betray me. In short he did with much importunity yield that he would come out the next night in a disguise. By this time it was Saturday, I take it to be the 6th of Oct.: an almanac will settle that: so the next night being Sunday and the shops shut, he would come out in a concealment, be carried in a coach, and brought to his own house, which he thought then was safest. I came and gave the duke of Monmouth an account of it; the duke I suppose conveyed the same understanding to my lord Russell; and I suppose both would have been there accordingly, to have given the meeting: but next morning I found colonel Rumsey had left a note at my house, that the meeting could not be that day. Then I went to the duke of Monmouth and he had had the account before, that my lord Shaftesbury did apprehend himself to be in some danger in that house, and that the apprehension had occasioned him to remove; but we should be sure to hear from him in two or three days. We took it as a waiver, and thought he did from thence intend to abscond himself from us, and it proved so to me, for from that time I never saw him. But captain Walcot came to me, and told me, that he was withdrawn, but it was for fear his lodging might be discovered, but he did not doubt but in a week he would let me know where his lodging was: but told me within such a time, which I think was eight or ten days, there would be a rising; and I told the duke of Monmouth and I believe he told my lord Russell; and we believed his frenzy was now grown to that height, that he would rise immediately and put his design into execution: so we endeavoured to prevent it, upon which my lord Russell (I was told) and the duke of Monmouth, did force their way to my lord Shaftesbury's and did persuade him to put off the day of his rendezvous. I had not this from my lord Russell, for I had not spoke a word to him: but the duke told me my lord Russell had been with him (I had indeed an intimation, that he had been with him but the duke told me, says he, I have not been with him, but my lord Russell was, having been conveyed by colonel Rumsey). After this day was put off, it seems it was put off with this condition, that those lords and divers others should be in a readiness to raise the country about that day fortnight, or thereabouts; for there was not above a fortnight's time given: and, says the duke of Monmouth, we have put it off but now we must be in action, for there is no holding it off any longer. And says he, I have been at Wapping all night, and I never saw a company of bolder and brisker fellows in my life; and says he, I have been round the Tower and seen the avenues of it; and I do not think it will be hard, in a little time, to possess ourselves of it; but says he, they are in the wrong way, yet we are engaged to be ready for them in a fortnight, and therefore, says he, now we must apply ourselves to it as well as we can. And thereupon I believe they did send into the country and the duke of Monmouth told me he spake to Mr. Trenchard, who was to take particular care of Somersetshire, with this circumstance; Says he, I thought Mr. Trenchard had been a brisker fellow; for when I told him of it, he looked so pale, I thought he would have swooned, when I brought him to the brink of action; and said, I pray go and do what you can among your acquaintance; and truly I thought it would have come then to action. But I went the next day to him, and he said it was impossible, they could not get the gentlemen of the country to stir yet.
Lord Russell—My lord, I think I have very hard measure, here is a great deal of evidence by hearsay.
Lord Chief-Justice—This is nothing against you, I declare it to the jury.
Attorney-General—If you please, my lord, go on in the method of time. This is nothing against you, but it's coming to you, if your lordship will have patience, I assure you.
Lord Howard—This is just in the order it was done. When this was put off, then they were in a great hurry; and Captain Walcot had been several times with me, and discoursed of it. But upon this disappointment they said, it should be the dishonour of the lords, that they were backward to perform their parts; but still they were resolved to go on. And this had carried it to the latter end of October. About the 17th or 18th captain Walcot came to me, and told me, now they were resolved positively to rise, and did believe that a smart party might perhaps meet with some great men[16]. Thereupon I told the duke of it; I met him in the street and went out of my own coach into his, and told him there was some dark intimation, as if there might be some attempt upon the king's person; with that he struck his breast with a great emotion of spirit, and said, God-so, kill the king! I will never suffer that. Then he went to the play-house to find sir Thomas Armstrong and send him up and down the city to put it off, as they did formerly; and it was done with that success, that we were all quieted in our minds, that at that time nothing would be done: but upon the day the king came from Newmarket, we dined together; the duke of Monmouth was one, and there we had a notion conveyed among us, that some bold action should be done that day; which comparing it with the king's coming, we concluded it was designed upon the king. And I remember my lord Grey, says he, By God, if they do attempt any such thing, it can't fail. We were in great anxiety of mind, till we heard the king's coach was come in, and sir Thomas Armstrong not being there, we apprehended that he was to be one of the party (for he was not there). This failing, it was then next determined (which was the last alarum and news I had of it), to be done upon the 17th of November, the anniversary of queen Elizabeth; and I remember it by this remark I made myself, that I feared it had been discovered, because I saw a proclamation a little before forbidding public bonfires without leave of my lord mayor. It made some impressions upon me that I thought they had got an intimation of our intention, and had therefore forbid that meeting. This therefore of the 17th of November being also disappointed, and my lord Shaftesbury, being told things were not ripe, in the country, took shipping and got away: and from that time I heard no more of him till I heard he was dead. Now, Sir, after this, we all began to lie under the same sense and apprehensions that my lord Shaftesbury did, that we had gone so far, and communicated it to so many, that it was unsafe to make a retreat; and this being considered, it was also considered, that so great an affair as that was, consisting of such infinite particulars, to be managed with so much fineness, and to have so many parts, it would be necessary, that there should be some general council, that should take upon them the care of the whole. Upon these thoughts we resolved to erect a little Cabal among ourselves, which did consist of six persons; and the persons were the duke of Monmouth, my lord of Essex, my lord Russell, Mr. Hambden junr., Algernone Sidney, and myself.
Attorney-General—About what time was this, when you settled this council?
Lord Howard—It would have been proper for me in the next place to tell you that, and I was coming to it. This was about the middle of Jan. last (as near as I can remember); for about that time we did meet at Mr. Hambden's house.
Attorney-General—Name those that met.
Lord Howard—All the persons I named before; that was the duke of Monmouth, my lord of Essex, my lord Russell, col. Sidney; Mr. Hambden junr., and myself; when we met there, it was presently agreed what their proper province was, which was to have a care of the whole; and therefore it was necessary some general things should fall under our care and conduct which could not possibly be conducted by individual persons. The things that did principally challenge this care, we thought were these: Whether the insurrection was most proper to be begun in London, or in the country, or both at one instant. This stood upon several different reasons: It was said in the country; and I remember the Duke of Monmouth insisted upon it, that it was impossible to oppose a formed, well-methodized and governed force, with a rabble hastily got together; and therefore whatever number could be gathered in the city, would be suppressed quickly, before they could form themselves: therefore it would be better to begin it at such a distance from the town, where they might have an opportunity of forming themselves, and would not be subject to the like panic fear, as in the town, where half an hour would convey the news to those forces that in another half hour would be ready to suppress them.
It was further suggested that if the meeting was remote from London, the King must either give an opportunity for a rising there by withdrawing troops, or else give the insurgents time to gather head. Other questions discussed were what counties and towns were the fittest for action, what arms were necessary, how the £20,000 or £30,000 which the Duke of Monmouth considered necessary for the rising were to be raised; lastly and chiefly how to 'order it, as to draw Scotland into a consent with us.' Another meeting was held ten days afterwards at Lord Russell's, when the same persons were present. It was then decided to send messengers to Lord Argyle 'to settle an understanding with him, and others to invite to England persons' that were judged most able to understand the state of Scotland, and give an account of it. Aaron Smith[17] was accordingly sent to Sir John Cochram[18], Lord Melvile[19], and Sir —— Campbell, and received sixty guineas from Algernon Sidney for his expenses. It was agreed that the conspirators should not meet together again till Aaron Smith's return. His absence for a month caused some apprehensions; 'but if his letters had miscarried, it could have done no great hurt, for it carried only a kind of cant in it; it was under the disguise of a plantation in Carolina.'