KALTENBRUNNER: Never; neither while they were operating nor at any other time did I see a gas chamber.
THE PRESIDENT: You are going too fast. Make pauses between your questions and answers and don’t speak too fast. He said that he had gradually by way of Intelligence, heard of the concentration camps in the Reich. Is that right?
DR. KAUFFMANN: Yes.
[Turning to the defendant.] You heard gradually about conditions in the concentration camps, that is what you said, is it not?
KALTENBRUNNER: Yes.
DR. KAUFFMANN: Do you recall my last question?
KALTENBRUNNER: No.
DR. KAUFFMANN: Whether you saw the gas chambers in operation?
KALTENBRUNNER: Yes, I already answered that I never saw a gas chamber, either in operation or at any other time. I did not know that they existed at Mauthausen and testimony to that effect is entirely wrong. I never set foot in the detention camp at Mauthausen—that is, the concentration camp proper. I was at Mauthausen, but in the labor camp, not in the detention camp. The total complex of Mauthausen, as I remember it today, extends over an area of 6 kilometers. Within this area there is a space of perhaps 4½ or 5 kilometers of labor camps. There are the largest granite quarries in Austria, and they were owned by the city of Vienna.
DR. KAUFFMANN: A picture has been shown in which you appear together with Himmler and Ziereis.