VON SCHIRACH: Yes. Now the situation was such in the administration that there was an official representative to take charge of national affairs, namely, the Regierungspräsident; for the municipal administration there was another representative, the mayor; in the Party, the Deputy Gauleiter in Vienna had the title of Gauleiter.
I should not like to belittle my responsibility for the Gau by explaining that, and I want to protect the exceptionally efficient Deputy Gauleiter who was there. I just want to say that in order to clarify my position.
DR. SAUTER: What really was your position as Reich Defense Commissioner, Witness? Was that a military position, or what was it?
VON SCHIRACH: That was not a military position at all. The Reich Defense Commissioner was simply the head of the civil administration, in contrast to the situation prevailing during the first World War, where the head of the civil administration was assigned to and subordinated to the commanding general; in this war the Reich Defense Commissioner was co-ordinate with him, not subordinate.
The tasks of the Reich Defense Commissioner—at least, that is how I saw my tasks—were at certain intervals, to co-ordinate the most pressing problems of food economy, transportation—that is, local and distant transportation, coal supplies, and price regulation for the Gaue of Vienna, Upper Danube, and Lower Danube, all of which belonged to Wehrkreis XVII.
There were several meetings for that purpose—I believe three all together. In 1942 the reorganization which I previously mentioned took place. Bormann carried his point against the Reich Marshal. The Reich Marshal was of the opinion that the Reich Defense Commissioner had to be Defense Commissioner for the entire Wehrkreis. Bormann wanted each Gauleiter to be Defense Commissioner, and so that led to the division. From 1942 on I was only Reich Commissioner for Vienna.
DR. SAUTER: Witness, it seems that a decree was issued at that time—will you please tell me when you were informed about it—namely, a decree by Reichsleiter Bormann, that not more than two Gauleiter could meet.
VON SCHIRACH: That is not a decree by Bormann; that was an order by Hitler.
DR. SAUTER: What were its salient points?
VON SCHIRACH: I must explain that briefly. Because of the fact that the Reich Commissariat was subdivided, I had to meet from time to time with the Reichsstatthalter of other provinces in order to discuss the most important questions, especially concerning our food economy. However, I believe it was in 1943, Dr. Ley came to me in Vienna and brought me an official order from the Führer, according to which it was considered illegal—that was the way he expressed it—for more than two Gauleiter to meet for a conference.