Mr. Tavenner. That is right.
Mr. O’Connell. And all that.
Mr. Tavenner. You trustees had very broad powers to determine what organization you would aid in the purpose of this trust which was, namely, to promote an economic system in the United States based upon profit for use. I am trying to find out how you exercised those broad powers.
Mr. O’Connell. Those powers were exercised by different trustees.
Mr. Tavenner. Of which you were one.
Mr. O’Connell. Of which I was one. All of us exercised I am sure our independent judgment on it. If it were possible to bring them all here, I don’t have them, but there were many instances where the trustees divided, where these grants were made by majority vote rather than by full vote and so on.
There are all kinds of situations that exist. But as far as I am concerned, Lem Harris never influenced me to make a grant to the Farmers Union or to any organization.
Mr. Tavenner. Don’t misunderstand me again. My question is broader than the influencing of you. My question is whether or not it influenced the action of the trustees.
Mr. O’Connell. Of course I don’t know whether Lem Harris went out and met with Jim Patton and Gardner Jackson, who was a trustee. I don’t know whether that actually took place. I don’t know whether he did these other things that are said. I don’t know whether he did them or not, but if he did those things and Jackson was going along then he had some influence and so on. But I think Jim Patton became leader of the National Farmers Union after I left Congress. I never got to know him real well, I think I have been introduced to him maybe once or twice. I know that Jim Patton was displeased with some of my votes on the foundation which were evidently reported to him by Jackson and went to the leadership of the Farmers Union in Montana to try to exercise influence as far as I was concerned in my votes on the foundation.
Mr. Tavenner. Did you have any other groups attempting to influence your judgment or decision in the matter of making grants?