Col. Mason admitted that the objection drawn from the consideration of expence, had weight both in itself, and as the people might be affected by it. But he thought it outweighed by the objections agst the smallness of the number. 38, will he supposes, as being a majority of 65. form a quorum. 20 will be a majority of 38. This was certainly too small a number to make laws for America. They would neither bring with them all the necessary information relative to various local interests, nor possess the necessary confidence of the people. After doubling the number, the laws might still be made by so few as almost to be objectionable on that account.
Mr Read was in favor of the Motion. Two of the States (Del. & R. I.) would have but a single member if the aggregate number should remain at 65. and in case of accident to either of these one State wd have no representative present to give explanations or informations of its interests or wishes. The people would not place their confidence in so small a number. He hoped the objects of the Genl Govt would be much more numerous than seemed to be expected by some gentlemen, and that they would become more & more so. As to New States the highest number of Reps for the whole might be limited, and all danger of excess thereby prevented.
Mr Rutlidge opposed the motion. The Representatives were too numerous in all the States. The full number allotted to the States may be expected to attend, & the lowest possible quorum shd not therefore be considered. The interests of their Constituents will urge their attendance too strongly for it to be omitted: and he supposed the Genl Legislature would not sit more than 6 or 8 weeks in the year.
On the Question for doubling the number, it passed in the negative
Masts no. Cont no. N. Y. no. N. J. no. Pa no. Del. ay. Md no. Va ay. N. C. no. S. C. no. Geo. no.
On the question for agreeing to the apportionment of Reps as amended by the last committee, it passed in the affirmative
Mas. ay. Cont ay. N. Y. ay. N. J. ay. Pa ay. Del. ay. Md ay. Va ay. N. C. ay. S. C. no. Geo. no.
Mr Broom gave notice to the House that he had concurred with a reserve to himself of an intention to claim for his State an equal voice in the 2d branch; which he thought could not be denied after this concession of the small States as to the first branch.
Mr Randolph moved as an amendment to the report of the Comme of five "that in order to ascertain the alterations in the population & wealth of the several States the Legislature should be required to cause a census, and estimate to be taken within one year after its first meeting; and every —— years thereafter, and that the Legislre arrange the Representation accordingly."
Mr Govr Morris opposed it as fettering the Legislature too much. Advantage may be taken of it in time of war or the apprehension of it, by new States to extort particular favors. If the mode was to be fixed for taking a Census, it might certainly be extremely inconvenient: if unfixt the Legislature may use such a mode as will defeat the object: and perpetuate the inequality. He was always agst such shackles on the Legislre. They had been found very pernicious in most of the State Constitutions. He dwelt much on the danger of throwing such a preponderancy into the Western Scale, suggesting that in time the Western people wd outnumber the Atlantic States. He wished therefore to put it in the power of the latter to keep a majority of votes in their own hands. It was objected he said that if the Legislre are left at liberty, they will never readjust the Representation. He admitted that this was possible; but he did not think it probable unless the reasons agst a revision of it were very urgent & in this case, it ought not to be done.