Mr. Liebeler. Tell us about the seminar, Doctor. How did it come that you gave this seminar on Oswald, to whom was it given, what was the general subject matter of the seminar?
Dr. Hartogs. Yes; every Monday afternoon, at 1:30 until 3 o'clock, the professional Youth House staff gets together in order to discuss an interesting or unusual child. At that time we selected Oswald because of the reason which I indicated, the discrepancy between the charge and the seriousness of his personality disturbance, and the seminar was opened by the Youth House director; then the social worker talked about the development, background and early history of the child; then the Youth House recreation department and household talked, and then the school department gave a report; then the psychologist reported on his findings, and then I acquainted the people who were present with the findings of the psychiatrist and recommendations which I made to the court.
Mr. Liebeler. Whose suggestion was it that Oswald be used as a subject matter for the seminar?
Dr. Hartogs. I believe it was mine, because I was the one to select these children.
Mr. Liebeler. Was there any report of the proceedings of the seminar prepared?
Dr. Hartogs. No; it is all spontaneous.
Mr. Liebeler. Just a spontaneous, informal sort of thing?
Dr. Hartogs. That is right.
Mr. Liebeler. No one made any memorandum of what occurred at that time?
Dr. Hartogs. No.