Mrs. Grant. I was on the west coast—he was gone. He was in Chicago and I think he was with Harry Epstein, I’m sure, in 1940 and in 1941 when the war broke out. Now, he has been back to California. Other members of the family came to visit my son and myself in 1940 and 1941, but he was already, I think, established with Harry Epstein. Harry would know something more about this than I do—I don’t remember, but I know they were selling merchandise.
Mr. Hubert. Do you know of any acquaintenance or friends that Jack had who had been convicted of crimes?
Mrs. Grant. Name them—I’ll admit to it if I know—yes—let me say this, we knew undesirable characters that grew up in our neighborhood.
Mr. Hubert. You remember some of their names?
Mrs. Grant. Yes.
Mr. Hubert. Would you state them, please?
Mrs. Grant. I don’t want it to be in the public library. These fellows are such nice fellows today, I heard. You know, if these things get out, they think we are degrading them. We were raised with a lot of people that become undesirables. They were people that lived in our neighborhood. Some went to school with us. I know of a fellow getting killed—he said his name was English—he was a bad character as far as we knew. He was 16 years old and I think they killed him on a swing somewhere in the area. We knew the family where they had three boys and I understand—I’m going to tell you about this family, because I told the Secret Service, Elmer Moore. His name was Lenny Patrick. Let me explain—we knew he existed. We never associated with him in our home or in our business or anything.
Mr. Hubert. That’s what I wanted to ask you. You see, I have asked you if these people were your friends or not.
Mrs. Grant. No; but they are people we know. We know their family—we see them, “How’s your mother, how’s your sister?”
Mr. Hubert. But there was no close relationship between Jack and people with criminal records, is that right? Is that a fair statement?