Dr. Servatius: I shall do so immediately; however, I have one question first. Are these not all idealistic points of view as the person’s motive?
Witness Dr. Ivy: Yes. On the basis of my discussions with people who observed these experiments at Stateville, Illinois, the idealistic motivation of this group was very high. As a matter of fact, the effect of this public service rendered by these prisoners is being followed up to see whether or not it has special reformative value, and up to the present time this question indicates that this public service has been of great reformative value, in that the incidence of return to criminality under parole is markedly decreased.
Q. Do you know Nathan Leopold, or do you know who he is?
A. Yes.
Q. Is it true that he was condemned to fifteen years in the penitentiary for murder?
A. To much more than that.
Q. Do you think he is the right person to give an opinion regarding the high morale status of the inmates of a penitentiary?
A. He can never expect to get out of the penitentiary, and I see no reason why he should not express himself, without any duress or coercion, accurately and as he feels.
Q. I will show you this report, and please ascertain if you have any remarks to make about it.
A. No, I have none.