Q. You are aware that in an affidavit of your codefendant Hoven it is stated that Ding himself carried out killings in Buchenwald with phenol. Had you given him instructions to that effect?
A. No. I did not give him any such instructions, and there was no occasion to do so because death by phenol is well known in literature; simply reading works on the subject would have sufficed.
Dr. Flemming: Mr. President, I submit Document Mrugowsky 28. I should like to submit it as Mrugowsky Exhibit 46. It is an affidavit of Professor Killian, who is a university professor at Halle/Saale. He says:
“In 1941-1943 I was consulting surgeon with the 16th Army in the East. We had experienced numerous cases of death and injury to the circulatory system due to the effects of gas gangrene serum. In my opinion, these bad effects cannot only be attributed to the inoculation of great quantities of unrelated serums, but also to the addition of one-half percent phenol, as is prescribed by law. Since up to 150 cc. of gas gangrene serum—sometimes even more than that—was given intravenously to wounded in the field, in my opinion the total quantity of phenol added then approached becoming a danger. This became obvious after four of my collaborators had had themselves injected intravenously with a phenol common salt solution of 0.5 percent density. All of them showed typical signs of phenol poisoning to a different degree. In a letter to the medical inspectorate I called their attention to the disappointing effects of the gas gangrene serum and to the detrimental effect of phenol, and made proposals for a change. Consequently, I was officially ordered to report during my stay in Berlin to Oberstarzt Professor Schreiber, who was a specialist on this matter. Present at this conference were Professor Mrugowsky and a junior physician whose name I no longer remember. I did not know any of the three gentlemen; I saw and spoke to them then for the first time. Apart from a few general questions concerning bacteriology, we discussed mainly the gas gangrene serum problem. I had to give an exact report on what took place at the front and on the symptoms of poisoning. The discussion then took two directions. First, the question whether it was possible for industry to substitute a harmless disinfectant for the dangerous phenol, and which one of the many substances would be suitable for this purpose.”
Number two is not important. And I can skip the next paragraph too. I come to the last paragraph:
“I well remember the substance of the discussions and declare that no mention was made of any experiments in a concentration camp, or of effecting euthanasia by injecting phenol. Such considerations never even came up for discussion, let alone an order in my presence by one of the medical officers. This would certainly have remained in my memory. I may add that a reason for such experiments did not exist since the symptoms of phenol poisoning are well known and may be found in any book on pharmacology. Apart from this, the question had been sufficiently settled by the above-mentioned experiments which the physicians had carried out on themselves. I am convinced that Dr. Ding’s statements are not true.” [Signed by Professor Killian, and certified.]
On the basis of instructions that he was to inform himself from literature about phenol poisoning—instructions which you gave to him—what did Ding report? Was the question of gangrene serum, and the deaths resulting from it, settled?
Defendant Mrugowsky: Ding made a report. I waited for it for some time and when it did not come I myself read up on this question. Then I was no longer interested in his report.
Q. On page 20 of the Ding diary (NO-265, Pros. Ex. 287) it says that a special experiment on four persons was carried out on behalf of Gruppenfuehrer Nebe. What do you know about that?
A. I have already mentioned the case of Hauptscharfuehrer Koehler, who was at the hospital at Weimar, who died from poisoning. Inaccurate statements were given about his death and autopsy. It was said that they occurred in the Buchenwald concentration camp—which is not true. At the discussion of the autopsy findings in the Reich Criminal Police Office, the opinion had been expressed that this death might have resulted from pervitin together with a narcotic drug. I participated in this discussion.